Munro Stewart

Mirror, mirror on the wall, what is the fairest trade for all?

Raptors

• Kevin Durant
• Kyrie Irving

Nets

• Pascal Siakam
• Gary Trent Jr.
• Khem Birch
• Malachi Flynn
• Svi Mykhaliuk
• Armoni Brooks
• 1st 2023, 2025
• Swap 2024

Here is a potential trade I like for the Raptors to get a player in the draft lottery this year. The Kings, Trail Blazers, Pelicans, and Wizards all might be teams they could potentially trade with to get Daniels, or someone else if they prefer.

Raptors

• Dyson Daniels - 7th Pick
• Eric Bledsoe
• Greg Brown - Hopefully

Blazers

• Gary Trent Jr.
• Malachi Flynn
• Khem Birch - Hopefully

Here are some other players I like for the Raptors in this year's draft. All of these are players I have picked out that could be good players worth picking, with a focus on defensive potential as much as offense.

Trade Up

• Dyson Daniels
• Tari Eason
• Dalen Terry
• AJ Griffin - Maybe

#33 Draft Pick

• Dalen Terry - Unlikely available
• Khalifa Diop
• Justin Lewis
• Ron Harper Jr. - Maybe

Undrafted

• Khalifa Diop - C
• Justin Lewis - F
• Ron Harper Jr. - SG
• Scottie Pippen Jr. - PG
• Ibou Badji - C
• Julian Champagnie - SF
• Hyunjung Lee - SF

Here is how I see the Raptors lineup if they could somehow add both Dyson Daniels and Dalen Terry. Beyond their top 10 players, they could keep Thaddeus Young possibly, or look to other free agents and undrafted players.

Lineup

• Fred VanVleet - Dalano Banton - Eric Bledsoe
• Dyson Daniels - Dalen Terry - Ron Harper Jr.?
• OG Anunoby - Justin Champagnie - Thaddeus Young?
• Scottie Barnes - Chris Boucher - Greg Brown
• Pascal Siakam - Precious Achiuwa - Khalifa Diop?

2-Ways

• Scottie Pippen Jr? Khalifa Diop?
• Ibou Badji? Julian Champagnie?

These ideas do not take into account future FA or trade upgrades.

Notes

• Make Achiuwa the starting center
• Move Trent to the bench as 6th man
• Resign Boucher as backup big
• Sign Champagnie to NBA deal as 3-and-D bench player
• Let Thaddeus Young go - Better Shooter or Younger
• Move Birch to 3rd string 7K contract only - Better Shooter
• ----
• Run offense through Barnes and Banton handling ball much more
• Turn Fred and Malachi into shooters more often than ball handlers
• Make Fred, OG, Malachi, Gary do catch and shoot 3 PTs mainly
• Make Fred and Gary shoot only from 3 PT line, not 5 feet back
• Have Pascal, Prec, Justin, Chris focus on catch and shoot 3 PTs
• Give ball to Pascal or Gary if near end of shot clock to score
• ----
• Draft or add versatile athletic center with shooting potential
• Bench is Banton, Trent, Champagnie, Boucher, 2nd Rd Pick or FA
• Play the bench more and rest the starters more in season
• Playoff 7-8 might be Trent, Boucher, Banton/Champagnie
• If keep Young, make him small ball center, trade Birch if possible
• Bench would then be Banton, Trent, Champagnie, Boucher, Young

Lineup Option 1

• VanVleet - Banton
• Barnes - Trent
• Anunoby - Champagnie
• Siakam - Boucher
• Achiuwa - Draft Pick / Young / FA

Lineup Option 2

• VanVleet - Flynn
• Barnes - Banton
• Anunoby - Trent
• Siakam - Champagnie
• Achiuwa - Boucher

Here are my thoughts and some potential trade options to be involved in a trade for Simmons currently.

Trade Options

• Raptors - 76ers
• Ben Simmons - Fred VanVleet
• Matisse Thybulle - Goran Dragic
• $8.2M Trade Exception - 2022 1st Rd Pick

Lineup 1

• PG - Simmons - Flynn - Banton
• SG - Trent - Mykhailiuk - Wainwright
• SF - Anunoby - Thybulle - Watanabe
• PF - Barnes - Bonga - Dekker
• C - Siakam - Achiuwa - Birch

Lineup 2

• PG - Dragic - Flynn - Banton
• SG - Trent - Mykhailiuk - Bonga
• SF - Anunoby - Wainwright - Watanabe
• PF - Simmons - Barnes - Dekker
• C - Siakam - Achiuwa - Birch

Lineup (No Trades)

• PG - VanVleet - Flynn - Banton
• SG - Dragic* - Trent - Mykhailiuk
• SF - Anunoby - Wainwright - Bonga
• PF - Boucher* - Barnes - Dekker
• C - Siakam** (INJ) - Achiuwa - Birch** (START)

* Note - Maybe Dragic and Boucher could be starters, with all our young guys playing together on the bench, to also boost Dragic's trade value and because Boucher is better than Birch.

** Note - Maybe Siakam or Barnes could actually play center, with Birch starting the year there as a solid player, but really being our 3rd string center later in the year when Siakam returns.

Thoughts

I think we want Thybulle instead of Maxey because he is a great defensive player with length like OG but at the 2-3 spots, similar to all the other players we like who are great defenders to start with. Contrary to the latest Raptors Digest video on September 2nd which says not to trade VanVleet, I think our deal almost certainly has to involve Fred. Why would the 76ers accept a deal with Gary Trent as the top player, unless they get Boucher as well as 4 first round picks and all young players? And that's a deal I don't think we want, just like we don't want to trade Siakam or Anunoby. Plus, I'm not sure we can include Trent in a deal before the season since we just signed him to a deal this offseason.

But our deal can now include Dragic, unlike my thoughts on trading VanVleet and Boucher earlier, before the NBA draft took place. And we can think of it like we traded Lowry but also got an extra guy we love in Achiuwa. We might be competing with a deal for CJ McCollum, who's a pretty good player and better offensively, on paper, and in the media than VanVleet, and he's also in the West where the 76ers don't compete against the Blazers. The fact that they could probably get McCollum is another reason why Gary Trent and Boucher likely won't cut it to make a deal.

In the big picture though, with our deal the 76ers get a lot of shooting which Morey likes with all of VanVleet, Boucher, and Dragic, while losing their two horrible shooters in Simmons and Thybulle. So it could be addition by subtraction and offer a lot of shooting while getting rid of their bad shooting. Plus Boucher is a great fit for them as a stretch four, as he is still extremely undervalued and a starting caliber player in this league in my opinion just like Norm Powell is. Boucher has been very high on PER both of the last two years, along with guys like Powell and Christian Wood before his deal with the Rockets. The 76ers can move Harris to small forward and have starters VanVleet, Curry, Harris, Boucher, Embiid and a bench of Dragic, Maxey, Green, Niang, Drummond. Green might start at SG obviously though.

We're in a decent position though, because the 76ers likely want to win now so they don't really want young players or picks like they might get in deals with San Antonio, Sacramento, Golden State, or other places. Plus if they want defense and winners they could like our guys, or particularly our main guy in VanVleet, better than guys like McCollum, Buddy Hield, or D'Angelo Russell. VanVleet to start and Dragic to play off the bench offers them a lot of playoff-tested defense, winning, experience, and passing to replace Simmons in order to win now. Plus they still get a good young player in VanVleet at point guard to make the trade look at least somewhat normal. Personally, I think VanVleet is a perfect point guard to fit with Embiid as well because he is a great shooter and leader, and because Embiid will get the ball more so you don't need a pass first point guard like Simmons, Chris Paul, or Kyle Lowry.

The above trade would be the most we might offer, but we might get it done for just 3 of those assets, or without Thybulle for as little as two of those assets. But I still think VanVleet almost certainly has to be the centerpiece to get a deal done likely at the very least, and I don't think we want to do a deal if it includes Anunoby or Siakam. To make the salaries match in order to get Dragic, I think the 76ers have about an $8 million trade exception from the Horford deal, which might even expire as soon as September 7th, or possibly later in the year.

The lineups proposed by me are based on two possible deals, one where we keep Dragic and don't get Thybulle. If we could keep Boucher and just give up VanVleet, Dragic, and a 1st round pick that would be the best deal we could hope for I think, but the least likely for the 76ers to accept probably, so I don't have a lineup based on keeping Boucher. The actual deal made from the list in my trade would depend on the 76ers and Raptors opinions on the values of Boucher, Thybulle, and the value of 1st round picks compared to those players.

Unlike many people who think Simmons isn't a good fit now without a starting point guard like VanVleet or Suggs, I'm actually higher on getting Simmons now than I was before the draft and getting Barnes. We can go all in on the strategy of defense, length, speed, and passing while developing all these guys shooting skills. Plus we still have some shooting in Siakam, OG, Flynn, Trent, Mykhailiuk, Watanabe, Dekker, plus Barnes and Achiuwa who do show potential to improve quickly. We could even possibly keep Dragic for our starting point guard for this year, with Flynn as a possible replacement in the future too.

But imagine how many rebounds we can get and how great the defense could be if we do leave Simmons and Barnes as big guards eventually, and decided that Siakam could play center if that's the case, instead of the skinny Boucher. Boucher could start at power forward if we are able to keep him instead of Dragic, and we would have 5 guys who are about 6'9" or taller who are pretty good players who can guard multiple positions. A lineup of Simmons, Barnes, Anunoby, Boucher, and Siakam would have a lot of potential, or even a lineup with Achiuwa at center instead of Boucher at power forward if Achiuwa's shooting improves enough in a year or two. If it's not enough shooting and we lose Boucher we can still have Trent, Flynn, or Dragic in there with a lineup like Simmons, Trent, Anunoby, Barnes, and Siakam.

Hey Ben and Ryker. Do you have any thoughts or feel like discussing this trade and potential roster lineup on an episode?

Here is a link to a super long take with some more thoughts about this idea, which neither of you will probably read at all 😉 Have a good one and great work on the new changes to your setup and the show this year guys.

Raptors Digest - 2021 Raptors Trade, Draft, and Lineup

Trade

• Raptors - 76ers - Magic
• Jonathan Kuminga: 2021 5th Pick - Fred VanVleet - Ben Simmons
• Matisse Thybulle - Terrence Ross - 2022 1st Rd: TOR
• Blank - Paul Watson - 2021 2nd Rd: PHI

Lineup

• PG - Lowry - Suggs - Flynn
• SG - Trent - Oladipo/FA - 2nd/Nix
• SF - Anunoby - Thybulle - Watanabe
• PF - Siakam - Kuminga - Gillespie
• C - Boucher - FA/Giles - 2nd/Maker

Details

I heard that Daryl Morey likes 3 point shooting. VanVleet, Ross, and Watson are all pretty great at that, while Simmons is horrible and Thybulle isn't known for shooting now either. They can also use wings who have some height to possibly play SF in Ross and Watson. Even though Watson is mostly a throw in, his 3 point shooting in the G league a couple years ago and last year in the NBA have been pretty great so he might be an interesting addition for Philly. While the Magic have a lot of good young players, they need to get going at some point with at least one real player instead of having only young guys with potential. Since they also have the 8th pick, maybe they could look at Simmons as a good young player to take a chance on for that 5th pick since Kuminga is another project who could take a while or end up a bust and isn't in that top 4 tier. They could move Isaac to SF and Simmons to PF to work well as a Draymond Green point forward with their young guards and centers in Hampton, Anthony, Fultz, Harris, Carter, and Bamba. Maybe Gary Harris to the Raptors, Tyrese Maxey to the Magic, Chris Boucher to one of the Magic or 76ers, or different draft picks could be other possibilities involved if needed to get this done by sending more to some team, but hopefully not Boucher if we don't have to of course.

For us, pretty much every single guy in that lineup is pretty good on defense, works hard, and has the potential to get better. That's how you win championships and develop players the new Raptors way under Masai. That's why I'm not super high on the Siakam for Wiseman, Wiggins, and 7th pick. Wiseman and Wiggins aren't known for their IQ, motor, hard work, and passing which we want our top players to have in spades. And I like Kuminga or Barnes with the 5th pick much, much better than who might be at the 7th pick. We can develop all of these good young players to get even better, while still having a solid team now hopefully. We're hoping that Suggs is the next Chris Paul or Jrue Holiday but a better scorer, and Kuminga is the next Pascal Siakam or even Kevin Durant, or somewhere in between.

While hoping we will win a championship with Siakam and VanVleet as our best two players might be overvaluing them, there is real potential with Suggs and Kuminga. Remember, we have never had one top pick like this under Masai Ujiri, let alone two great potential young talents to develop. This is a big potential opportunity, and to have both of those guys as bench players to start off could make a good team now. Though, the future championship team might hinge around Suggs, Kuminga, Anunoby as the main core, or whoever steps up and gets better even if it's Siakam, Trent, Thybulle, Boucher, or someone else. The potential is there, and keep in mind the idea might be to possibly trade other pieces in Lowry, Oladipo, Boucher, Trent, or even Siakam, etc. at some point to get one more potential star somehow if Oladipo or Siakam isn't that guy, to go with whoever our two or three stars are at that point. In the meantime, we have a solid team of young players to start this rebuild officially, with Lowry transitioning to the bench or being traded depending on Suggs development.

Actually, I personally like keeping Siakam with these guys and having the core of Suggs, Kuminga, Anunoby, and Siakam, along with a center which could even be Boucher in my mind possibly. A lot of length in that lineup and Kuminga could potentially have and develop the offensive skills and quickness to play SG, or Anunoby could even play SG if not. It would be interesting also because that lineup would feature 4 players with African heritage, which I think Masai would be proud of and find interesting. I am surprised with how little emphasis the media has noticed or talked about the fact that Masai has gotten many of these guys with African heritage who have been undervalued. Trading for Ibaka. Drafting Siakam and Anunoby. Picking up Boucher. It's another reason why I think he could be super high on Kuminga, as someone with even more offensive potential than any of those guys.

Ben, I was glad to see you come around on Jalen Suggs after you went and read about him after we got the 4th pick. I have a feeling the Raptors might absolutely love this guy and possibly have him 2nd on their board, ahead of both Green and Mobley. They might be ecstatic that they could get him and see it as their chance to build for the future around a pass first point guard who can also score, play great defense, and lead a winning team. I love Suggs so much I might take him first overall even though I know that sounds crazy, and I agree with you that he is a perfect Raptors pick to build around for the future. He might never be known as a top 20 player just like Lowry or Siakam, and always be underrated like every Raptor because a lot of his value comes with his defense. But his amazing defense, hard work, IQ, passing ability, team basketball, pass first approach, and winning attitude make him a potential great long term leader for this team. And he still has the talent to potentially be known as a top 10 player too, though it's a crapshoot for that with any player you pick obviously. I think he could be a real playoff starter and winner as opposed to just a regular season player, league leading scorer type, or slam dunk contest winner. Remember, we won with Lowry (Suggs) who is a great all around player who works hard and plays defense, Leonard (Anunoby) who is a great defender and also turned into a great scorer, and Siakam (Kuminga) who is athletic but also has some good offensive skills, not with Vince Carter (Jalen Green) who is a super talented offensive player who scores on his own a lot, and isn't known for defense, working hard, and wanting to win at all costs. Green should be amazing though, but he might not be there for us anyway.

Ryker, here are 3 reasons you might like Suggs and this roster more than you realize, even over Mobley or Green. If you don't like waiting to get good, I think Suggs is currently known as easily the most win now guy in the draft, and guys like him aren't often at the top of the draft. While going with a rookie in the playoffs is always risky, he has much more potential than Green, Mobley, Kuminga, or Barnes, let alone other players. Because of his solid defense and IQ, he might be able to hang in there in his first year. Remember, even our lower picks in Siakam, Anunoby, and Powell all started in the regular season on a top Raptors team in their first year, with Powell starting in the playoffs some. Why? DEFENSE, MOTOR, and HARD WORK. But Suggs also has top pick offensive potential. Personally, at this top pick I think we should go for the best long term potential player and win now shouldn't be important, so if Green or Kuminga was actually better long term I would take that chance. But I think Suggs could also be that long term all around player as well for the reasons listed above, even though I do like that Suggs is also more NBA ready too which is just a nice plus for us.

Second, you've talked about how VanVleet isn't a pass first guy, and playing VanVleet and Lowry together isn't great. Suggs is actually a perfect complement to Lowry, Flynn or even VanVleet in my mind, while also being the potential pass first playmaker and long term solution to take over from Lowry in a league dominated by great passing and shooting point guards on many of the top teams. When or if Suggs is playing together with Lowry or Flynn for now, their defense could be great together at guard, especially paired with Anunoby and Siakam at forward. But we can now have more length and strength with Suggs playing SG potentially, and still go with potential two PG lineups that have worked for us in the past with Lowry/Vazquez, VanVleet/Wright, and VanVleet/Lowry. It doesn't matter that Suggs is more of the passer. Lowry or Flynn plays PG on defense where they are good, with Suggs having better length and strength to guard SG and SF. And Suggs plays PG on offense with Flynn or even Lowry because of his playmaking ability and Kyle's shooting ability. Then Suggs is also the long term solution, so if he turns out amazing you could then trade Kyle and have Trent, Thybulle or someone else at SG, or even play Flynn and Suggs together if Flynn gets really good too and you like more playmaking.

Third, this trade has the potential to get guys back at their regular positions and have good length and rebounding, except for Boucher out of position at center. We got 3-and-D guys at SF, shooters and potential scorers at SG, scorers at PF, passers at PG, and athletic rim protectors and rebounders who can also switch onto smaller players at C. Nurse will play around a lot as always, and also because some of these guys like Kuminga, Suggs, Trent, Thybulle, and even Boucher have more versatility than previous players like VanVleet, Gasol, Valsooinawallsauce, and even Lowry. But there is potential to have more guys at their natural positions or not playing way out of position, especially if you do get a bigger center that is more talented than Boucher, or eventually trade Siakam and have Boucher and/or later Kuminga or Anunoby at PF.

As far as Boucher starting at center, I realize it seems odd and everyone worries most about getting a center or two. I don't as much. We have so many other good young players with this roster and can find centers even though they didn't do great at it last year going with the big brutes in Baynes and Len. So many things could happen before the season and Siakam is out to start off, but Boucher starting at center is my big crazy prediction and wish, even though it's not the perfect solution. In previous years I had two crazy predictions that came true. After we traded for Kawhi, everyone assumed Valanciunas would start and Ibaka would go to the bench, but right away I thought Ibaka should start along with Green because the overall defense could be amazing. It was double addition by subtraction by getting rid of DeRozan and moving Valanciunas to the bench. Getting the two worst defenders out of the starting lineup made a big difference, along with trading CJ Miles and JV later. We had enough offense even though it wasn't the best in the league, but with Ibaka and Green in the starting lineup, and later with the Gasol trade, the defense was ridiculously amazing. Then the following year everyone assumed Powell would start at SG and take over from Green, as VanVleet was a clear backup PG. But I thought VanVleet should start because he was clearly the better player, and Nurse also made that change which people thought was really odd.

It's the same thing with Boucher. If we don't get someone obviously better, which could be tough with how great Boucher has been per minute, I think we should take his weaknesses and just go with him at center alongside Siakam once Siakam is back. Boucher is still a great 3 point shooter, floor spacer, rim protector, shot blocker, very mobile big who can switch, and great rebounder. Yes he's skinny and will give up some easy baskets, backdowns, and rebounds that look bad. But Gasol, Ibaka, and Valanciunas all had their weaknesses too. Boucher is at least good at both ends of the floor unlike Gasol on offense except his passing, and Valanciunas on defense except his rebounding. I'm not sure we should leave Boucher on the bench just to start some solid rebounder big guy who can't shoot. With such good defense and length at the other spots, it might be better to have Boucher's good shooting, mobility, and offensive skills in the starting lineup.